Recording for Oct 8 (Session 3)

OK, so welcome back.

Day 3, being management.

Um, I had a question for you around like we just did a little bit of review on some of the OKRs and business problem statements, so sorry that wasn't recorded here, um, but getting a lot more user focused here, starting to understand a little bit more of the connectivity of what are we looking for in behaviors and changes to the user focused, especially as um we ran into and highlighted.

Some things here on um uh your XC XP bike and um these weekend trail riders who might be going and purchasing them.

Um, so the question that came up for me related to homework like you flushed out uh your OKRs a little bit more.

You actually came back and revisited your business problem statement to try to get a little bit closer.

We even came up with an additional persona there, there's more than just an urban commuter who's riding your bike.

Um, did you talk with anybody in your organization? About any of these business problem statements or personas or any of these au cares.

Not yet.

Yeah, I would only say the persona is based off of, well, obviously the company we got plenty of weekend trail Raiders, so the persona is based on people I know, but no, I didn't directly talk to anyone.

Matthew, No, OK, um, so it's, it's good to dive into, right? Cause as well, these start to start to navigate the story, and they help us make sense of a little more of what we're gonna get into today, uh, because if, if you're If other people in your company see these problems as well, right, the OKRs start to make a little bit more sense, right, of like, is this, um, are these Are these things that they can see being measured? Are they results that even seem to make sense? Are we, um, are we shooting too low, and we should be more ambitious? Are we overly ambitious? We're not even sure that there's even a chance we can hit that yet.

Um, we might discover more of that today, but, you know, those kinds of things, and just that conversation can invite, um, new insights into where you might want to take these other missing.

OKRs perhaps other missing aspects of the persona, uh, that kind of bit.

Earn, you said you have people that you know who may fulfill this this persona of the weekend writer.

OK, so that was actually the other part of it is, where would you find these people, right? Does this persona even exist? You already know a few that are out there, um.

I would encourage you in the future.

Talk to them.

Maybe you think about like, can you talk to them about some of these items and and like how would they buy your bikes? What do they care about in terms of their ride experience? Um, you can really start to learn more about maybe some of the missing obstacles that are out there, or missing needs, things that they have or want, or like, you know, is it, do they actually care if it's easy to clean and maintain, right? Cause like it's gonna get dirty all the time.

It just needs to work while it's dirty.

Right, I don't know, um, right, the validating the assumptions, right? Validating the assumptions, yeah, yeah, trying to get through that, um, because that's, that's really where we're at here in this class.

We have, we've been going through lots of assumptions, right? Staring at some very high level of assumptions and starting to constrain that problem a little bit more at a time, over and over again, um, to a point where we can now start focusing our discussion here.

It might make it, it might be difficult.

You know, to prove these things out, um, but definitely more focused in terms of, is this really a problem? Is this the right problem? And how and who could we talk to to find out? And how would we know if um if this is really a problem with them, like, will they take this action? Could we see this key result happening? Does this outcome, uh, actually exist and matter, right? Or is there something else that's going on? So, You know, we are trying to help figure out as well, like, if we're gonna make all these guesses, there's so many different ways in which we can go and solve the problem.

Right? Let's not waste our time working on too many different things that could just be wrong.

OK.

So with that, let me bring this over today.

Um, so here's what we're gonna talk a little bit more about today about how do we know that we're right? Um, so we just did some of the review, uh, and some of our thoughts and questions.

Uh, we're gonna start today by talking about solution hypotheses, right? Um, that again, these are, we're still going to make some assumptions, assumptions that this thing that we could go do, this solution to the problem, uh, this, this output, this activity, whatever, actually helps us, uh, drive the desired behaviors that we're looking for with our customers.

Right, to create the appropriate outcomes and impacts for both them and our business that we're driving towards.

All right, so, um, hypothesis statement, we're going to focus on a specific format here in this class.

We've done that a couple of times, right? Just an opinionated way on how to write a hypothesis statement.

OK.

And so in this case, um, it's just a we believe, right? We, we think, we think it's going to happen.

It's still our assumption.

We believe that this outcome will be achieved if these users successfully obtain this user outcome or benefit with this feature solution, OK.

Uh, so in this case we're talking, oops, it's funny how that disappeared.

I'll have to pull that, there we go.

Um, we're focused on the key result, right, the outcome, the thing that we're looking to see happen, the, the, the, the activity we could measure.

Right, um, will be achieved if these users, what's our persona, who's involved here, uh, attain this user outcome or benefit.

What is the, the need or obstacle.

That we saw in our personas, right? Their, their goals, their objectives, their job to be done.

What are they trying to go and achieve there, right? With this feature solution, um, the feature solution is the only thing we haven't talked about yet here in this class on purpose, right? Um, we, we've maybe had lots of ideas and I'm sure, you know, you've got many things going on.

I could do this, I can make this so we could we could do these things to get this to happen.

Uh, but we haven't really codified any of it yet.

This is where we're gonna start to get there.

So we should, we already have the cure results, the persona, and the persona's goal, with which to start filling this information.

OK.

Um, I'm going to show you another place in which we can put and use that here in a moment.

Um, so as an example, right, we believe that the number of accurately completed and submitted mortgage applications will increase by 35%.

We had that the other day in, um, as an example in the business problem statement, right, that we want to see an increase by 35% in submitted mortgage applications, or I think the, actually, maybe we need to make a tune to this, a tweak to this because we had 20% increase in submissions.

Uh, if repeat home buyers, that was our persona, right, feel prepared and confident in their application, what they want out of it with an email-based mortgage application process.

Ah, versus the solution.

All we said before was a simpler application process.

Now we're talking about maybe it's an email-based mortgage application.

OK, um, so this again fills in all of those key pieces there.

What's the objective that we're looking for, right, the, the, um, the key result that we want to see happen with with whatever outcome there, who's involved, what matters to them, and how could we go about actually starting to solve that problem.

Right.

Um, now, last little bit here and then I want to go back over to you all for some questions and such.

Um, you already have, like I said, most of this information, but I'm going to point out something else in our, um, on the mural board and another tool that you can use to help you organize it a little bit more.

Uh, so what this is showing uh for you is, um, the lean product canvas, uh, which we do have a copy on our board, we just haven't put our information there yet.

Um, and it, and it highlights some really key things, right? The users or customers, right, that's one part of it.

Here's our persona, Michael, we could see Michael, right, the ops manager, Michael, the ops manager, Michael, right, we just grab that and repeat that sticky over and over again.

Um, what are the things that they're trying to do here, accuracy of uh rate of post interactions, things of that kind of nature, those are a little bit more up in here, right? What are we trying to get out of it? Um, we can see the user benefits, right? Reporting tools show accuracy, these could come from the user benefits side or, oh, I'm sorry, um, they assure that our data is accurate, um, I can improve my cost, etc.

those who come from these user benefits section, right? So what are Michaels, needs, and obstacles, we could start seeing the user benefits, and then we start crafting solutions, which is another box for as well.

So what that looks like on your board is over here, the lean product canvas.

Let me just highlight into this, um, most of the things that we've come up with so far fit in here, right? So the the business problem statements that we've crafted go into box one, right, the most important problem that the business needs to focus on as it relates to what matters towards our customers, etc.

um, what are the outcomes that we're looking for that's also, uh, as well, um, it, it stems from our business problem statement but starts to come into the ORs, right? What is the main thing that we're looking to see in actions and measures? Uh, and measurable actions we take.

So, um, box 2 is, is that first, we believe that we can achieve this business outcome, this part, right up here.

The users, our personas go here in box 3, right, who's doing it? Um, the user outcomes and benefits, the jobs to be done, what are they seeking out of it? What's their need or obstacle? What do they want, uh, comes in box 4.

Why do they care? Our solutions will start to fill in box 3.

What are the potential ways we can get there? And then we're going to focus on filling in essentially box 56, turning those things from 234, and 5 into hypothesis statements.

And then how do we go learn, right? What do we need to learn, how are we gonna go and do it? We're focused on the bottom part of this canvas here today.

OK, so I'm gonna pause there before we get into our next little bit.

You, what can I help you with now? Questions or insights into uh the the solution hypotheses, their structure.

I think I'm kind of just uh waiting to see how we start applying it for any questions come to mind.

OK.

I think Nope, no questions here.

Sorry, I was on muting.

OK, now I just sometimes it's an indicator you got something that you're ready to talk about, so that's why I called you.

Shall I see you good? or you have anything you want to chat up.

OK.

Well then, let's do that.

All right.

So here's what we're gonna do next.

Um, we're gonna write some uh some solution hypotheses.

Uh, what I'd like to do is give you all a bit of time uh to focus on, on bringing that together.

So, um, And let's see, where is it on the mural? It is number 6, feature hypotheses.

We're going to start to figure out what potential features, things you can go and build, and then I want you to specifically use that format.

We believe that our business outcome, what is the thing that you're looking for, right, um, can be achieved if these users pick your persona, can achieve this goal or outcome, what matters to them, right, with this feature by take some of the feature ideas we have and start putting them in there.

Um, so just give that that structure a bit of a whirl and start seeing what you can come up with, right? How many different hypotheses might you develop on that either leverage different features or focus on maybe different goals or outcomes for your users, those kinds of things to start crafting hypothesis statements, OK? Um, I'm gonna give you.

15 minutes to work on these.

We'll come back and talk a little bit about what you've built.

Um, if you need me, call me, I'll be here, but otherwise I'm gonna let you all get to work, uh, and work with each other before I go and contribute any further.

That sound OK? All right, so, uh, I'll be here like I said, muted and off camera, but 15 minutes for you all starts now.

Well, we want to talk about our XC and XV features.

Yes.

It's an easy one.

Just kind of started thinking about what's currently on the XC and XP platform.

Replaceable batteries is one thing, I guess, uh, you should specify.

It's not just replaceable batteries, it's Hot solvable battery is the, yeah.

Plug and play.

Yeah.

Um, And I guess we do advertise it's kind of like our low power, it's it's our X lineups, that's like the.

Catered towards, I guess not say lower power, but you know we're not talking like full on adventure.

Is that something that we consider a feature? Yeah, I mean we could might say, you know, lower power supports newer writers, right, they're less likely to send themselves into the surrounding bush.

Ma.

We can say, does XCXP have configurable renas? No, right? No, I don't think it's a different, yeah, they're just the different r modes.

Yes Um, I'm looking at the copy from.

From our website purpose built for maximum off-road fun and most affordable in its class.

Category leading performance in a compact lightweight design.

Intuitive throttle response easily swappable battery.

It's perfect for riders seeking thrills without.

Shifting gears and delivers a simplicity, reliability, and fun factor you've come to expect from zero motorcycles.

Yeah, that's definitely feature no gearbox and clutch.

Let's see, I should probably open that page too.

Compact lightweight design.

So we're talking about design, affordable in its class.

I mean yeah, when we think about lightweight, you know.

In the event, the writer does mess up it's a lot.

Less painful to recover, you know, if your bike is down in a ditch somewhere and you need to go fish it out yourself.

Mhm.

Laptops touch pads with you.

Factory tuned suspensions switchable traction control.

It's not All right, let's try making some hypothesis based on Features we have.

So, We believe that's.

What do we believe? what kind of business outcome we're trying to achieve? My gosh.

With something like saying um You know, we believe that our You know, our pre-order conversion rate.

You know, an increase in pre-order conversion rate can be achieved if The weekend trail rider.

Can use hot swappable batteries to mitigate concerns over low range.

When they're out on the trail.

How does that sound? I, I didn't get the train of thought, so your logic is that.

If they get to experience it.

Then We'll have better conversion.

Yes, right, they, they can use hot so they have a feature that allows them to.

Have that outcome or our business outcome.

OK.

Perfect.

Would that extend to Everything else too.

I'd say and I, I, I think that that is even more true with uh ride mode.

And lightweight design, because that's something that we can't convey.

In ads in any way or or online in any way.

Right.

But I think we should type that at least someone's already typing.

that up if you want to modify that box.

What I was thinking was we believe that.

Alright Yeah, cause as I say, it's not quite a business outcome, but right, mitigating the You know, the, the customer's concerned over low range.

Yeah, it's not quite, is it? Is that considered a business outcome? Or is that just a function of Something.

Hey guys, I'm gonna pause timer for a sec.

I think you are, the question you just asked, Erin, is important.

Um, I think you're missing a piece of the format.

Take a look at the format.

Take a look at what you wrote, and tell me what part is missing.

Is the goal or outcome? Yes, right, for the user's goal or outcome, right? So, um, you, you, it's more like we believe higher conversion rates can be achieved, we believe that we can capture more of the e-bike market.

Um, can be achieved if we can show riders.

Um, can reduce their anxiety over or their their range anxiety.

Uh, by leveraging the hot swabble batteries.

That makes sense? Yes, OK, so yeah, so like just you know, slide that other portion that you have in the middle up a little bit and then like you can achieve it um for the we can show writer by, you know, um, so they can achieve what? What did what did they achieve, right? So we, we believe like.

Our business outcome can be achieved if those people can do what, like what if they, if they can achieve what outcome for them through your solution, OK? Um, so with that bit of feedback, I'm gonna go back off camera and restart the timer.

Good luck.

Thank you.

Adam take over, so I, so I can watch.

Sure, right, so.

posted right now the text, the text reference.

Right, we achieve our conversion rates of 2, right, so the user behavior outcome we want we're concerned about is, yes, Rich just said.

Can mitigate um range anxiety.

And we can say, you know.

By experiencing the convenience of hot swappable batteries while out on the trail.

Cool, so now we have something for hot swappable patterns.

I guess didn't he mention that we should like the business outcome isn't necessarily the conversion rate, but I guess being more prevalent in the dirt bike market.

Less so about the conversion rate themselves.

I mean we could tie the two together, right, cause Yeah, at least in my mind, you know, the understanding of, you know, achieving a stronger position than the dirt bike market.

Can be done through con you know, increased conversion rate.

Cause at least in in my mind, right, just saying we believe that we can be.

You know, the Well, I guess that works too, you know, saying like we could be the best selling dirt bike.

Um, If the weakened trail rider can mitigate the range anxiety through the feature that we just explained.

That definitely works.

It's No one dumped one.

I guess the other thing is that is it a problem just continuous to reuse the same business outcome, or should they be different? at least in this case, you know, I've narrowed in on the business outcome of the conversion rate.

Um, so I guess that's kind of where Matthew is more.

At least in my mind, the more abstract goal of becoming the best selling me dirt bike.

Could be better used.

Yeah, I'm not sure if it's a business, but what I was trying to type up in that post to the side is, is kind of.

I guess one thing I was looking into is like as like an outcome is that we're like a leader in.

Um, I guess like the casual ride experience, um, with like the XBXC lineup, not necessarily dirt bike related, but more so catering towards the.

The the weekend writer like the like in the casual writer.

But I don't know if that melts too much into like the users themselves and kind of.

Well, so you, you're you saying that gave me, you know, a good idea to say, right? We believe we can.

We can achieve the best IC to EV conversion rates.

By highlighting, you know, by advertising to newer writers that, you know, the convenience of the lot, you know, no gearbox and clutch.

Or the experience of not having a gearbox and clutch while out on the trail or something like that.

OK, that's IC to EV.

Conversion.

I guess.

Well, one thing I'm not sure, 11 thing I'm not clear about here.

If we make a hypothesis, are we making the hypothesis about a lagging indicator or a leading indicator? The reason is with a leading indicator, we can actually test the hypothesis.

If we do this, something might happen.

But if it's a lagging indicator.

We can't test it, but it's a true hypothesis in the sense that we'll do something and then the market will respond and after the event, we know if it's true or not.

I'm not clear about that.

So, uh, like the conversion rates.

that we are the best in class in Uh, in, in the dirt bike market, in the dirt bike segment is A lagging indicator, yeah.

But conversion rates, we have some control over.

Uh, wait, even the conversion rates are lagging in a career.

Yeah, cause then I'll determine if the feature where advertising actually matters to.

Yeah, leading indicator would be, let's say the number of demo rights.

Oh, no, now I'm confused.

Is the hypothesis.

OK, so this one says the format says.

The business outcome.

So if it's the business outcome, then we, we are essentially looking at a lagging indicator.

So both of those, the, the ones that you said just now, both of you said, I think are valid.

Although the ice to craft one trying to come up with.

OK, so we have a a little bit of questions there at the end.

You wanna dive into that a little further? Yes.

OK.

So, um, you, you highlight an interesting point.

The things that you're currently focused on as business outcomes are more lagging, lagging indicators.

In fact, what you're really looking for, what you're sort of putting there about higher conversion rates or like becoming the best selling e-dirt bike is more of a business impact.

Right, like, you know, it's, it's the if we create, if we increase higher conversions, right, if more people buy our bikes, that's a lagging indicator, we'll become the best selling e dirt bike in the market.

That's an impact that we are now, we are now the leader in the space.

Um, there are many other ways to become leaders.

We can buy out all of our competition.

Right, we, they could all just go under, right? There, there are other things that could create that, but, um, so I think you've got a little bit of both of them showing up here.

It's not horrible though, right? It's showing why uh that matters, but you are talking about, um, conversion rates is the business outcome, which is a bit more of a lagging one, and that's not again necessarily a bad thing here in this case.

Um, so like, You, let's talk about leading ones here in a second, but like if we talk about uh the, the user or the the example before it was that we believe the number of accurately completed and submitted mortgage applications will increase by 35%, right? So it's the people actually doing the thing.

So, uh, not just that, and, and the case in, uh, the one here is that um we can showers will buy our bikes, right? So conversion rate is, is the important aspect, but like that will increase the, the number of pre-registered.

Um, uh, you know, the, the number of pre-registrations into actual sales, right, the conversion rate by X, um, if, uh, if we do these things.

So the only thing that maybe is missing here is like what's the, what's the number that you're aiming for? Like what's the, if we're thinking about the outcome there, it should be a measurable type of, you know, something measurable that we can look at, um, and what's happening, so we know that they're converting by how much.

We believe that we can achieve a conversion rate of 60%.

And become the best selling e-bike, you know, there, uh, if we can show riders can mitigate the range anxiety by experiencing the convenience of hospital batteries while on the show.

Um, so let me, before I go into reading, um, Kind of story does that tell you? Well, yeah, it's telling the telling the story of No, perspective but the right, the weekend trail rider.

Maybe he's not familiar with EV's who, yeah, is legitimately concerned like how long can the battery last if I'm out and about, you know, they don't want to become stranded out in the middle of a trail or cut their day short.

It's in my mind.

Good, Matthew.

What about you? Um, Sorry, I'm still trying to, I'm not the best at this still.

um.

I'm sorry, is this question catering towards the, the hypothesis we wrote or is this the? The one you wrote, yes.

I'm sorry, my brain is just not working right now for some reason.

OK.

Um, um.

So, I, I ask like, what, what do you get out of that story, right? Cause I'm kind of curious, like, here's a, here's a quick thumbs up thumbs down.

Does this feel like a good story to you? I just feel like, like something that's compelling.

Yeah, I I mean like this looking from like the experience that we the looking at the future.

Um, I guess mainly counter about the whole I this maybe just my.

I guess my experience in with our with bikes and these swappable batteries in the past is that there's still kind of like, you know, the, there's still a concern about.

Yes, I can swap out the batteries, but for the batteries, I swap out, how long does that take to recharge it? Um, so I guess there's still some.

And there's like gaps, but like it seems like there's other not not a complete solution, yeah, it's not a complete solution.

Sure, that's the main thing I'm seeing from this.

It's, it's part of this, it's, it's a way to solve the problem, right? Yes.

Right, um, and that's fine, where we have, I think you, you listed up multiple different features.

That was just the one that you focused on here, right? Um, so hot swap batteries, different ride modes, perhaps also changes, um, the, the, the quickness of which you consume that battery.

Uh I like that you talked about, um, Uh, when you're talking about different ride modes, you're saying like, do, do we really need this to be like the torkiest thing that's out there because like if you're a new, you know, uh trail rider and the bike only just jumps away from you, like how turned off for you, right? And that ability to one also, um, you know, like different ride modes highlights some interesting things.

It, it makes it easier for new riders to get on, right? It also uh perhaps changes the amount of um of, of energy that you consume.

When you're writing, which also helps with, you know, range anxiety.

Both actually probably go to the problem, you know, like the job to be done of um a user wants to go and have fun in nature.

Right, and, and providing a way of like zipping through on a on a motorcycle on a trail, it is fun, right? Or it's a way to create a thrill in nature, right? We might have the right product for that job to be done, and the different ride modes actually kind of helps solve that in different ways and and target some different kinds of things, both range anxiety and um I'm, I'm a novice.

I don't know what the heck I'm doing.

Uh, you also talked about that in terms of gearbox and clutch, which I thought was really cool too, right? It's, uh, I want to just go out and have fun, um, and without having to worry about like, how do I ride this thing, right? If you can, if we can make it easier for them to get on and actually start writing because we have no gearbox and clutch, that makes it easier for them to achieve their objective of going out and having a good time.

Right, so I think what what you honed in on here as well is actually the much more specific like I'm, I do this thing a lot.

Like I'm a trail rider who goes out a lot and I've got anxiety like about giving up my my ice bike for an e-bike.

Which I think there's I think there are two, sorry, go ahead.

I was gonna say is, is it kind of in a sense kind of like at least in the framing that we currently have, we've kind of more focused directly onto like a user problem versus what their desired outcome is.

Yeah.

Yeah, like the, the, the user problem is perhaps range anxiety or lack of control, right? That's a problem that they have, um, but, but the, the thing that they're actually trying to achieve is different, right? They want to stay out for a long time and they want to go have fun, right? And I want to, I want to, I want to come back out.

I want to have enough fun that I want to come back out or stay out longer, right? Those kinds of things.

Uh, so I think you stumbled upon that in a good way.

Um, sure.

So there are, uh, so if I just look at the one that, um, we wrote the, we believe that our we can achieve our conversion rates, uh.

What, what I'm pointing at right now.

So there are two parts to this that I can see.

There's the There's the content and there's efficacy of the content of the idea, and then there's the efficacy of the hypothesis, the way it's been framed, right? So the, the content of the idea that uh we can affect the conversion rate by letting people experience the hot swap of the battery.

That might be 10 of us based on our experience so far.

But we can't be sure, right? That's, that's not, we're just going off of what our opinions are.

But if you look at the framing of this, every single part of this can actually be tested.

It's a valid hypothesis and every single we can, can it affect our conversion rate.

We can check correlation.

We can do a survey before and after to check if, uh, check how people are feeling with um their range anxiety and, and the fun they had on the right.

And third, we can see how many people actually showed up to, you know, experience it.

So almost every part of actually every part of it can be tested.

So from a, from a framing of the hypothesis, I, it looks like a great framing whether or not it's a result that is in aligned with what we expect.

I, I think we should leave that to the experiment so it doesn't buy us our experiments.

Yes, absolutely.

Right, they, and the, the, you're going to get to some interesting experiments in a minute, um, but you're right, like the fact that it's testable.

Um, makes it easier to connect to, right, and makes it easier to like to find out what's this the right idea.

And it might point out that actually they don't have range anxiety.

There's something else that's going on, right, wrong, and we can learn more about that.

We can tweak our proto persona a little bit further based off of the experiment that we run for the solution that we think will get the job done.

Right, and realize, actually there's a different job that seems to be emerging as a theme that we need to keep that we need to come back to.

Um, understand how we measure that kind of outcome, like what would, what would it look like to solve that problem and then come up with a new hypothesis.

So, so if I'm understanding this correctly.

Uh A bad hypothesis is the one, is, is one that we can't answer yes or no to.

If we can if we can figure out a way to test it and then get to uh to a yes or no uh answer for every hypothesis, then it's a Then it's a good start.

And, and then after that, it's about optimization.

Do we have all the resources to try every single hypothesis? Yeah, obviously not.

So we, is that fair? It's pretty close.

Um, my, my thoughts are, uh, on that are two things.

One, the more, the more specificity you put into this to derive that yes or no result, right, um, helps you understand more about the hypothesis.

And so I think the one thing that I, I see missing in your hypothesis is what's the conversion rate you're looking for.

Right, because that uh we can our conversion rates of 2%, 40%, 90%, like what that that adds that specificity makes this more testable and it makes it more of a definitive yes or no kind of answer.

And we can put in 90% and get to 87%.

And then the result is like did we prove that to that hypothesis to be true? No, but we also saw a lot of good interactions, and a lot of good data, and maybe are just our assumptions on the fact that we'd hit 90% were wrong, but we weren't wrong by a lot, right? So it was a it was a no, but a good no.

In that case, and sometimes the no is like, you know, also a good no is no, like, in fact, like we're only getting to 12%, we really um we need to get conversion rates of 90% to stay in business.

We need a shift Right now, right? So when you have that level of specificity, and you can get to those yes or nos, um, it helps you make other decisions within your business.

All right, so that's one part of my two part answer.

Questions on that? Uh, I, I think I'll hold my question for now.

Um, OK.

So the other piece goes to what you were saying or what uh I think we're just talking about of maybe what we find out is that our solution.

Isn't the right solution.

Right, that the feature that we came up with isn't it isn't the thing that's actually doing it, that the outcome that we're looking for, um, still matters to us and to our writers, uh, and we, and we know that this is we're actually holding on the right people, but we didn't find the right thing, um, and so it it's, it's like a, this is, this is good.

We don't know.

Like people aren't saying yes or no, like they're, we haven't seen any, any shifts or whatnot.

Um, it doesn't, it might mean that the feature was wrong, right? And so it could be towards your, your understanding, is it a yes no kind of thing.

It could be that the answer is no, right? Like we've we've disproven this hypothesis.

It doesn't mean that we also built a a bad thing.

It just means that we also haven't stumbled on the right ones yet.

So it's, it's almost more of like an inconclusive.

Right, like this thing maybe made some shifts, but there could be other factors.

So again, probably specificity helps um eliminate that, that if there are other things that could influence conversion rates, um, like it's they actually they don't care that it's, you know, hot swivel bikes, it's the fact that, you know, you're charging $90,000 for a motorcycle that people use for fun, and that's just way too much money for them to your bikes don't cost that much if I recall, right? I think they're like a lot less than that.

But it was funny.

I was, I was talking with a friend of mine, um, on Monday, who, uh, I think I said, you know, his, he has a friend who has an e-bike who wants a zero motorcycle.

I just, this is, I think the way he put it it was like you're the gold standard.

Then I'm like, well, and I'm like, why did she have it and they like he was like, oh no, I just wonder if it's too expensive.

It looks, no, actually that's pretty comparable.

It feels like that feels right.

It's just, I guess is that the toy that she had or she just didn't know at the time, or like what was the problem? And so there again, there are other things that could influence your conversion rate, that maybe you're seeing, well, there's movement here, but that's not the only thing.

So it's inconclusive in that we We don't, we can't just test one hypothesis, perhaps to meet the objective.

We need to actually test numerous hypotheses, um, and figure out which ones we need to test in which way.

Yeah, that, that was a question I was gonna ask.

I uh what I was gonna ask is it, it doesn't.

It seems like we need to have a first we need to have a whole bunch of hypotheses listed out, framed well enough that we can test them, and then we, we probably need to prune that down to a set that we actually want to test.

Not all of those can be testable or even if they are testable, we might not want to do, or we might not want to test all of them.

Um, so there's some pruning.

Based on our previous experience that needs to happen.

That was the question I.

In fact, that's the next part of our content.

So, uh, I'm gonna pause, uh, I just, I'm gonna jump into this for a second, and then, um, we're, we're gonna pick a hypothesis to work from in the next section.

Uh, so I'm gonna give you just a few more moments as well to see like is there any, after, you know, all this discussion, are there any other hypotheses you want to work on, because you're gonna pick one of them, right? And if you like the one you have, great.

And if not, I'll give you a few minutes at least to, to see what else is there.

Um, so we also have the hypothesis hypothesis prioritization canvas.

So it's just a way to look at, um, and actually that URL at the bottom is wrong.

I told Jeff, but I, I'm like, it's not question marks.

You just search for it and you can get there.

Um, I can give you copies of this too.

I'll put them in our uh authority flow.

Um, so the Rich on that note, so the slides that we have in the, in the link that you sent us.

Those are, I think, much older.

They don't, they look nothing like this and there's also some content that's actually missing.

So let me tell you a little bit about that.

Um, yeah, I will give you a copy of the current slides, um, post class.

I'll make sure that they get up to, um, you know, to clarity flow there, um, but they just rebranded Sense and Respond with like a whole new feel and look to it and made changes to that material this summer.

Um, Josh just flew from Brooklyn to Barcelona to meet up with Jeff and do some work, including the face to face that I'm going to this weekend.

Um, so part of their, their other thoughts is they, they said, yeah, we know the videos are up to date.

We probably need to re-record them and reupload that material and, and do it.

Um, I think they've, they've just gone through enough change that that had been on the back burner, and now it's getting to a point where it's like, oh, this is a problem.

The content's still right, but like good, but it's not up to date.

And so, um, yes, that I will bring that feedback to say we have real customers who are noticing that there's a drift.

Can you guys please re-record the videos? Um, so, but, and then, yes, I will definitely give you a, a copy of this material, uh, for, for post class, yeah.

So, um, on this prioritization canvas, there's a couple of key things you want to look at, right? Um, what's the perceived value and what's the perceived risk, right? And again, these are, these are guesses in some sense, but they help us understand some things and as well, the reason I asked about the story, like that compelling story is because imagine you're telling us to your, to an executive, because you want to get one of your hypotheses funded to go learn to actually create an impact in your organization.

Um, if, if we believe it, they might believe it too.

If we look at our our hypotheses and go like this doesn't quite make sense, it's not gonna make sense to anybody, OK? And part of it as well as understanding a little bit about like, well, what's the value out of this? Like, what could it actually do for us? And then also understanding like how risky is this? Like is it risky to do hot sopable batteries? Um, maybe it's probably more risk than, um, you know, uh, configuring a ride mode, but again, I don't know.

I, I just software to me seems easier.

Um, maybe it's the opposite direction.

Uh, and, but they could still both create some high value if they can create that conversion, right? So if it's, if it's low risk, high value, just put it out there, right? Like just go for it, um, because if you're correct, you're going to create a a a really big business impact there.

You're gonna create a lot of value for both your customers and your organization.

Um, and that's great, like we don't really need to discover, just, just go do it, because if it's wrong and it doesn't create the value that we're looking for, at least it was cheap and it was low risk and like either, either like it was low risk that we didn't have to invest much into this or as low risk that it didn't create a a big PR nightmare for us, right? So who cares? We learned something, move on, try the next thing.

OK, um, the ones that are high risk, high value, um, are the things that we, we want to get more data on.

And like, we're not sure yet.

We, this could be a challenge to us in feasibility, this could be a challenge in terms of, um, like the actual markets and what's going on there.

There's a lot of various risks on that.

We have to probably try other experimentation techniques, uh, some other prototyping.

Other types of um of interviews and, and interactions with customers to learn more about if this is, if this is worth pursuing further before we really just put something out there, right? And then when it's low perceived value, this is like when we're not really sure if we should actually do the thing, right? Uh, low risk, low perceived value, um, we don't again need to test much, we could probably just go do it, um, but they might not.

Then it might not matter to our customers or to our business.

And so it's really a question of do we need to do this? Why is this an option on the table? Is it a compliance piece? Is it to make one shareholder happy? Uh, is it, you know, a um a very noisy customer talks about it, and they could influence us, but then again, they might not like.

You know, we just, we want to learn a little bit more there and so it's again this thing of, we could go try something, but we should really ask, is it worth it before we do, or just, you know, say like have a conversation with that noisy person be like, I, I see, I see the problem, but what else could we be missing, right? Or, or inform them more about the broader market that you're trying to, to help.

And then the things that are low, you know, low value, high risk, just don't, don't do them.

If it's not going to create a big impact for your customers.

Uh, or your business, and it's going, and it could potentially cost you a lot.

That's not a bet worth placing.

All right.

So, uh, let me then come back here for a moment.

Um, so yeah, here's what I'd like to do.

I, I like to say, you said you've got to, um, I'm just gonna give you a moment to like another 5 minutes to craft any other additional hypotheses you can think of, uh, because, um, after we get through our next little bit, we're going to pick one of them to expand on further.

OK, so try again, think about, um, I really liked how testable are these? how specific could we, could they be, how yes no of a decision could they lead us to.

Those are all really good points to lean into as we start thinking about what is the overall business outcome and and and measurable outcome that we want for us that impacts our users, um, what is the thing that they are trying to achieve, um, and what are the various features.

You've got a lot of them.

That uh perhaps you want to lean into some other different ones to see how they go, OK? So, uh, 5 minutes before that starts now.

Well, first, what kind of hypothesis would you like to see now then? No, I, I added one on the thrill of the ride mode thing that we discussed earlier.

I was thinking.

I'm We could add one more on affordability because like what he said just now, somebody didn't even know, right? So I'm.

Do people even know that these are affordable, or do they see it as something else, or do they even know that it, yeah, do they just assume that it's electric, therefore expensive, like the rest of our products? Yeah, yeah.

So what, because all of these are about demo rides that will need something else.

So I, I wanna just add that.

So I added this one for.

Um, What This one was earlier.

Yeah, that one was just a copy.

Yeah, I wanted the copy for the affordable one.

So, OK, now I can go and get for that.

Not we can trail riders still can achieve.

They're trying to make one about the the sale, the sale price.

Yeah.

What is the feature there, that it's.

With its price competitive, I don't.

Technically it's a feature, right? It's comparable to the rest of the market.

Comparable or cheaper then? I just wrote.

Something in A non-English first language.

You, you can read it.

It's, it's well.

I'm gonna put it in some other color.

Here Whoops, somebody locked it.

OK.

Well it was locked it right now.

What does it Um, achieved if.

So this has to be a weekend trail rider, right? Because we're only talking about XCXP.

Can we use it for urban commuter? Um, well, actually, no, we can't in the EU cause it's street legal in the EU.

OK.

Urban commuter.

Yeah, I use.

I mean, I guess with the With the user outcome in this case be that, you know, They feel like they're getting, you know, they want a You know, whatever the value proposition, you know, a good value proposition for.

You know, if if a user is cost sensitive, what is their Was that was their desired outcome when they buy something that it's worth it, right? They need to have an understanding of what they get for the value or All they need to, uh, or we need to create enough desire.

That It overrides their their budgeting aspect.

Yeah.

I, I'm just gonna put something here uh so we can decide which one we wanna do.

You, you both can decide which of the other three.

I just want to complete this one.

OK.

Um, so here's what I'd like to do next.

Um, let's break until the top of the hour.

It's about 10 minutes.

When we come back, we're gonna start figuring out how do we learn about our hypotheses and what experiments might we try.

To see where these things go, OK? Um, so, uh, feel free to take a break, keep writing if you want, but, um, I'm gonna pause the records.

OK.

So now we're back, uh, to talk a little bit more about testing your hypotheses.

Um, as we looked a bit before, we've got 4 different hypotheses listed here.

We're gonna start highlighting and honing in on, on, let's say one of these to start testing out, uh, here in a moment.

Um, maybe we can, you know, think about which maybe is, it gives us some of the biggest impact, uh, maybe has the right amount of risk, uh, to get in there so we can start figuring out how we can go and test this out.

OK? Um, so, my next question for you here is, um, MVPs and experiments, um, MVP, have you heard that term before? OK, cool.

Um, what is an MVP? Minimum viable product.

Uh-huh.

Minimum viable product.

So here's what I'd like to do next, um, where I take 20 seconds.

I'd like everyone to pull up chat in Zoom.

And you're gonna type, but don't submit.

Uh, until I tell you to, um, over the next 20 seconds, what does a minimum viable product mean to you? OK, so start typing your answer, but do not send it.

There it says, what does minimum viable product mean? Bye.

321.

What you got? And then are you still typing? Yeah, I'm just finishing up my, my thought here.

OK.

So what, what you got? Let's see what she, what's there so far.

Um, we gonna build to test their core hypothesis, uh, early representation.

Matthew to you, what does MVP mean? Initial version of prose initial feedback.

OK.

Did not finish that grammarly.

So we have um We have a couple of different directions, right, that we go in here, um, but they, they both start, they, they talk about something small here, right, um, an early representation of our product, an initial version of our product, um, something that we can observe that helps us with the direction, and then she he said like this, the least we need to build, right? I just, not just an early representation, but the least thing that we need to build.

In order to test our core hypothesis, and that is kind of really where we where we need to hone into, right? The smallest thing that we can do or make to test our hypothesis, that's an MVP that that goes straight back to um the lean startup definition, right, which is the smallest thing that you can do or build to create the maximum amount of validated learning.

Right, and validated learning in this case is, is that sense of when do we see users taking actions, uh, often, you know, thinking of outcomes and behavioral changes, right? When do we see them taking actions and making an exchange of value, uh, for us and the thing that we think is valuable, right? So when we start to see that, that interaction, that validates the learning that we're going for.

So the smallest thing that we can do, uh, make or do to test our hypothesis, share us your.

Like I said, pretty much right there in the money, uh, answer is the question or the answer to that question is our MVP.

Um, I've heard so many different definitions of MVP over the course of my career, um, like it's the smallest thing that we'll build before we're ready for the market.

That's probably gigantic.

So, um, it doesn't tell us anything about just an early representation.

It's not about observing direction.

It's like, it's again a lot of assumptions on where we go.

So, um, You're closer than most of the people I work with that on on the term MVP.

We're going to focus more on the experiment side of things here, um, but those are again like that, that core definition of the smallest thing I can do uh to test our hypothesis.

That's what we're headed off to here, then we're going to figure out what is that experiment.

OK, um, so we're, um, I'm gonna walk you through some of the, the pieces here and then we're gonna get into the next exercise.

So when we're designing an experiment, we want to understand what is it that we need to learn first, right? What's the most important things that we that we need to be leaning into to learn, um.

Alright, remind me again, uh, Shay, you've read Lean Startup, Aaron and Matthew, you have or have not? I'm not.

I have not.

That look and sure you've read this.

Yeah, OK, that's a, um, so.

There's an interesting piece in there, um, we don't necessarily have to go quite this far in, uh, in terms of our learning, but when I think about learning first, um, sometimes the things that I want to find, if they, if they exist are the leap of faith assumptions, uh, as Eric put it in the book, he says, like, what are these make or break kind of things that like we have to take a leap of faith, it's until we try this and find out and learn.

Um, and we won't know if this is, if there's even any reason to pursue this any further, right? And so it's that we've really got to get this in front of people.

We've got to see if this is a market that anybody wants.

We got to see if they want, um, uh, an e-bike solution or if they, if they want to even be on a bike versus if they want to be on a four wheeler, right? There's so many different kinds of things that we need to, that we maybe need to learn that's like, there's no point doing all of the other pieces if we can't.

Uh, prove out that that leap of faith assumption.

Um, here we're gonna, like I said, we're going to hone in on some of our hypotheses, and we're trying to figure out what do we need to learn first in relationship to our hypothesis and then what's the least amount of work that we need to do to learn that.

OK.

So, for example, we can just talk to two customers.

It's a pretty easy thing to do, right? The least amount of work.

I at least go talk to two people who ride bikes, who ride our bikes, see what they think, right? That can give us some ideas.

Um, maybe we build a 3 question survey.

And send it out to 10 people.

It's pretty easy.

Google Forms, something like that, right? Just push it out there, um, could be who you send it to is interesting.

Are you sending it to? You know, your personas, do you, do you know those? Are you saying it to like grandma and grandpa because they're they always help you out on stuff and they're willing to take your survey, right? So we could send out to a couple people, uh, maybe we make a paper prototype and show it to people.

So, uh, I have an app and I have an idea about a change to the app that we can make, but rather than building the new app, um, I'm actually just gonna go and create on paper, here's what the screens would look like.

Here's what this would be, how, how would you interact with this? What do you think and try to get that concept out.

So people prototyping is an often cheap way uh to go and do something if, um, if building the actual thing is too costly, um, or we, we actually could go build it, right? Like if, if it's like a software solution, if it's pretty cheap to build, um, we can build and and perhaps even release two versions of it so we can AB test and learn which one drives the behavior that we're after.

That would be good too, right? All these things have different kinds of investments that go into them.

OK.

Um, Questions there.

OK.

OK.

All right, so here's then what we're gonna do next.

Why my slide come up.

Um, we're actually gonna go and get into this and pick one hypothesis test, and then we're gonna start breaking it down to, in what ways could it be wrong? Um, and what's the spons experiment that we could run, OK? Uh, so we have these same kinds of ideas up on the mural, so I'm gonna take us back to the mural, uh, and I'm gonna show you I'm gonna do this live with you.

Here's how we'll run this exercise.

Um, I'm gonna let you all pick the experiment, and then I'm gonna run through the questions and do the typing for you.

You can tell me what you want and I'll get it up on the board, right? So which of these hypotheses Is the one that you want to go and start working with.

Which one seems to be the most important hypothesis for you to go and test? I think the The constant the The EU can have one targeting the EU urban commuters.

Um, cause I think the value of understanding if the price actually matters or not.

Um, That's my opinion.

Yeah, I would say so too, because like the other ones would require like also using some like demo rides at the very least.

Uh, that, but for something like, you know, understanding the pricing and stuff, that, that's just, you know, that can be talking to someone who's on the fence about buying a bike, someone who is just kind of, you know, readily browsing, not necessarily also considering or someone who is actually in the market, like there's a kind of a a wider.

I guess audience that we can uh capture with that, even though we're focused on the urban commuters portion, like there's still kind of like a lot of different uh people that we can talk to in regards to that.

I would go for the opposite.

I'd go for one of the 1st 3 because it's complicated enough that I'd, I'd want to pick pickri's brain on, uh.

One of those, especially the part where how do we test it without building much.

That's a really interesting question.

Um, I'll let you pick whichever one you want.

I, I think the story you're evolving on the ones on the left is a more powerful story than the one on the right personally, right? Like you're, you're, you're talking about business revenue essentially on the right, and do people get it, but there's not a lot else to learn there.

Um, whereas the things that's like, yeah, you can argue, sorry for interrupting, um, but you can argue at the, the last one kind of really is table stakes if, you know, we price ourselves out then there's no point, right? It's kind of table.

Yeah, and but you also, you could learn that just by looking at your competitors pricing versus your pricing and start to see, you know, what's what's an acceptable margin.

Yes or no, right? And then there's not much else to learn there.

Um, But do they care? Do they know? Why do they know? How do they know? That kind of thing is interesting, um.

Towards experiments.

Here's something that I also want you to think of.

I am gonna actually ask you to go run an experiment.

If you're focused on the EU, can you engage with the EU before our next class? Yeah, I mean, we have plenty of.

Uh, I mean, Yeah, we have plenty of co-workers in the EU who write our products, diesel.

All right.

Just asking it.

So, which one, what's the one that we're pulling over? Is it the EU one or are you, are you trying to override and pull them towards you? You're gonna have to, it seems like maybe make a compelling case if you want them to work on one of the other three.

Uh, um, I, I still think it's, it's, it should be one of the first three because it's, there's some content in it that There's enough ambiguity in it that we need to navigate and that we need help navigating.

The last one is more straightforward.

We know what to build even for the last one.

Hm.

The 1st 3, it's not super clear, especially for the case that the situation where we're in, where we're trying to build out everything that we can think of, and we're relying on people to just give us a list of features.

Navigating one of the 1st 3 might be, in my opinion, that's that's the.

Best use of our time, but I'll leave it to the two of you because I'm, I'm gonna be gone in 13 minutes and I, I, I, I don't want to leave you with something that, uh, you know.

You don't want to work.

I'd argue for the first one since that's hardware inherently has in my mind the higher risk than the software, which kind of lead to the ride modes we discuss kind of more on the software side.

There's the hardware aspect of, you know, that design, I think will be interesting to run, you know, this experiment on.

Matthew, how you feel there? Yeah, I can get behind testing the first one.

OK, I'm gonna copy that.

Um, sure, I think you brought up a really great point.

This back one is like you, you actually talked about the experiment, right, that it is the feature, but it's also the experiment like build a web page that lists competitive price points.

That's a, that's a pretty easy and cheap experiment you could run to help them figure out the value for the price.

There's many other experiments we we can run there too, but that is a very specific experiment, not so much of a, a feature of your product.

And the other ones you really talk.

Sorry, sorry, go ahead.

I was gonna say the other ones you're actually talking about features of your product and, and if I recall from last week, things that are more directly related to things that you're doing.

Right, like your, your team maybe is more involved with the middle two than the one on the left, but the right one was more like this would be the marketing product, like the marketing side of it.

And to use your matrix that you had earlier, it's in my mind that's like low risk, medium value.

OK.

All right.

So, here's what we're gonna do.

Let me pop it up here.

That's the hypothesis that we're gonna go and test.

Um, so, first question, how might this fail? Like, how, what are the things that could go wrong here, um, and, and say that this actually, this doesn't work, this isn't this isn't possible, um, people don't even sign up.

People don't sign up.

Good.

What else? And this is in the context of what can go wrong with the experiment.

Uh, with the hypothesis, the hypothesis, OK.

Yeah, we don't have an experiment yet.

We're gonna talk more about the experiment in a bit.

We think the feature that that we want is hot swappable batteries on the trail, um, and that helps mitigate range anxiety.

Um, we don't have hot swappable batteries.

We don't, uh, let's say we don't have the stairs.

Mhm.

Where we run out of spares, spare batteries to swap.

A it's not even developed yet.

And this is even before development, correct? Right, uh, so we don't actually, it's not that don't have hot salt batteries, um, we can't.

Swap batteries.

Quickly.

Right, um, so the, the feature of Being able to do that doesn't exist.

Um That's good.

What else? We don't have a dirt bike.

Ah.

OK.

Let's say or we don't have access to a trail that's long enough.

To get some anxiety.

Uh, Or like the trail doesn't, if it's not long enough, like it's not like there's no elevation change, that would also effectively help us track the range.

Hm, um, so the trail might not be indicative of what users would actually deal with, right? Yeah.

Yeah, or like, yeah, trails like too paved or, you know, too compressed, and that's not.

Like a thrilling black diamond trailer on trying to run down.

OK.

I didn't type that right.

Um, OK, let me, let me do something here for a second.

All these are technical risks.

Can we do it? Actually, this is also a technical risk.

This is the only one you have right now is a market risk.

Should we build this thing? Like people don't sign up, people don't care.

What else might be going on in the should we build it side, like what, what matters to the market, the people that help, they should help you decide if this is even if not so batteries is even something you should bother with.

Yeah, I would have said, you know, that that technology doesn't exist, and I guess that's still a technological risk.

Yeah.

People don't know.

You don't know what.

No about um.

They don't get to know about our um.

Uh, experiment.

Actually, that's about the experiment.

So, uh-huh.

Um, They don't even know about, let's say dirt, electric dirt bikes.

Good.

OK.

What else? It's winter.

Say that one more time.

It's a seasonality, yes, um, ah, um, it's not the right season.

That's just a that's a timing thing, right? We have to wait a long period of time here.

Um, I might give you one that I thought maybe would come up, um, people don't care about range.

We we think they have ranging anxiety.

Yeah.

What, what if, like, regardless of how far they go, you can keep them entertained for two hours, and that's like physically exhausting enough, trying to ride their bike, but that's all they really wanted.

Or maybe you got people that are trying to be out there for like a 10 hour day, right? So range and time are maybe, you know, correlated here, but Uh, what, what are they doing? Are they like they ride around really quick and then they stop? And they hang out for a little while longer and then they go back to it, but that's enough.

Like, what's the, they don't care cause that's actually not.

Something that um uh you already are long enough on range.

You know what I mean? Definitely makes sense.

Yeah, that's.

One of the core assumptions.

Yeah, core assumptions that they get to a scenario where range matters then.

OK.

Yeah, so like these kinds of things, right, um, they don't allow electric bikes is more about the experiment and like, you know, so if we're thinking about this thing, right, we want them to experience it.

If they don't sign up, they won't experience it.

If they don't know about electric bikes, they're not going to experience it, right? Uh, it's not the right season that matters, right? But if they don't care about range, like this could fail because we can mitigate range anxiety, but they're actually, we find out that that's not.

An issue, right? Or um they don't run long enough to exhaust the battery.

That's another thing that that's actually not an issue.

That feature maybe doesn't need to be built.

We, so should we build this thing, right? Should we, should we, you know, when we go to test this hypothesis, should we build this feature here, um, those maybe impact us a little bit more, right? And then afterwards we can find out, well, actually can we build it? Like, is there even a way that we can swap a battery quickly? Um, or not in a bike.

Um, that's another technical thing that if, if they don't care, there's no point doing any of those.

Right, so I'm gonna, I, I'm gonna suggest we, we work on one of those ones and should we build it next, um, but like there's another, I was just listening to Josh talk very recently about the same kind of concept and, and honing in on experiments, and he's like, um, let's let's take the cure for cancer as the feature, right? This is, this is something that is all market risk, no technical risk, right? Um, because there, there's, if, if we had a cure for cancer and people could pay whatever the cost is, they would buy it, right, if they had cancer.

If it was like it took too long, it was too painful to get through, you know, it's only affordable for like billionaires or something, yes, maybe they can't, but it doesn't mean they don't want it.

Now we have to figure out how to make it cheaper, right? Like how do you, the technical part is the hard part there.

So it's, it's really all technical risk of how do we do that, right? So, um, when you're looking at at these kinds of things, the technical risk, can we build it, you know, we just try to figure out some way to build it.

No one's built it before, unless like physics prevents you from doing it, you can probably build it, right? So the question then becomes, do we even bother investing the resources? So should we build this from a market risk is a key aspect.

Um, are there one of those that you want to take further, or do we, with that in mind, of should we build this hot soluble batteries piece for um and getting them to do that while on the trail, um, is there any other should we build this risks that you're curious about, other other things that could make it fail? Erin, you're muted.

Sorry I didn't hear that.

No, even then I was just uh muttering to myself, being question to myself.

Here's, here's maybe another way to look at it too, um.

What would keep you up at night? Like if, if this was like a, gosh, you know, if we can't get this right.

Um, I don't know what what I'm doing here, like, or, or the, the secret fear, the thing that you, you don't want to say to your boss, right? Like, oh, this is a great idea, but you know, it's probably gonna fail in this kind of way and but I'm nervous to to speak that out.

Are there any of those that come up in this regard? Yes, for me, like something I'm thinking of is, um, you know, yeah, you can hot swap a battery pack in this case, or you know, in this scenario, but we don't get the owner would have to buy the the the other pack essentially.

It's not something that's included with the motorcycle, so I guess a concern I would have from that scenario you basically just outlined is.

Is the Is the ability to swap packs, does it improve the experience such that the extra costs required to purchase the.

The, you know, extra packs worth it.

Do people actually want to pay for this feature, essentially.

We don't want to buy a 2nd battery, that's a risk.

Right, I that that's, that's pretty key.

Um, they're not willing to, to pay for the future.

They think it would be really helpful, so they can keep running around having a good time.

But they're not willing to make that investment.

Um, so that would be good too.

Love that.

What else? Any others? At least for me, that's the the big one that.

I thought of.

Cool.

Earn.

Yeah, I was just kind of, I guess my mind just keeps tending towards more technical risks.

You know, or something just like they don't have the ability to carry the battery out there.

Yeah Yeah.

Um Ah, that's an interesting thing.

Uh, people can't bring an extra.

Battery with them.

Mhm.

Um, cause yeah, like, how are they getting there? Are they towing their bike and the battery? Uh, is it like loaded up in a truck, um, or do they riding to the trail with the battery on their On the bike somewhere like I guess like just, you know, chill on the back and If that's the case, how far can they go to get there? Before they almost immediately have to change it up.

And those are interesting questions, which, you know, you're, you're also highlighting another piece like Even, um, I would imagine even gas dirt bikes could have a similar problem.

I don't know what the range of a gas dirt bike is, uh, and how long people would ride it for, but you could exhaust all the gas in there and you've got to have a can to fill it up with, right, and do that on the go and bring like 2 to 5 gallons of gas with you.

Um, to write some more, um, but again, I'm not sure what kind of range they're looking at there and how many people do that, and, and, you know, like, are they gonna bring it anyway, right? Cause if they're gonna bring it anyway.

Yeah, maybe that's actually, who knows if that's really concerned.

Right, so like that's maybe if if I were to prioritize this one I'd say that's a little bit less than Then, you know, things like, like this one and this one, those two on the left feel like some of the Biggest impact things to me about, do we even do this thing, right, if they're never gonna buy it, if they're not gonna ride long enough as well to exhaust it.

Like we, we shouldn't, we should just either make a bigger battery right from the beginning, right, or we're already good to go, right? But, um, the cool thing is all these help us find out many like perhaps many different experiments we could be running, right? So this is good, uh.

I, I'd like to, I, I think it would be good to hone in on one of these two from just what I'm feeling here.

These feel like perhaps some of the, the riskiest things that we could, uh, you know, have to impact our future, um.

Which one do you want to work with? Which one do you think is is the right amount of risk and and the biggest amount of potential value in learning here for us? Yeah, I think in terms of the overall risk, I think determining if people want to buy a second battery is a lot lower risk than Figuring out how well.

I guess it depends on how you create the experiment.

I can see ways you can make these.

Make like writing testing how long people ride, you know, a higher risk than just asking them.

OK.

So like if they, if the battery is big enough that they wouldn't have to exhaust it, they wouldn't want to buy a second battery anyway, or if they're really, really short, they're gonna have to swap them.

How many batteries do they have to buy? Are they gonna need like 5 batteries for the day versus 2, right? Do they want to do that kind of thing? So it's like maybe this is the thing that leads to, will they even buy one, right? It's like, like do they Do they already do we need to do it at all, and then with that, right, would they buy it if we gave it to them? All right, so here's what I'm gonna do.

I'm gonna take this guy.

We expand upon it.

What do we need? To learn here.

Right, so Yeah, go ahead.

Well, I guess just kind of just what we've already kind of said to a degree, well, how long are they actually riding it for? Like what is their actual range requirements, so to say, for a day of dirt bike riding.

Yeah.

Uh, How far do they ride down the shows? How long do people ride? Um, good.

What else? And if we wanted to also think about the other risk about costs, you know, just taking that data, understanding, OK, like for the typical rider from this experiment, how many batteries would they need to purchase, so I guess.

Uh, that's again, that's going off of the other wrist that we're not necessarily zooming in on.

But um let's see.

What if, um, you know, in the case of what you said, right, and if they ride to the trail versus they trailer the bike in, you know, what if they already have You know, some alternative that Doesn't require them or.

How do I phrase that.

Is it kind of like, how did they get to the trail? Yeah, essentially.

Um, that's kind of there's something more there.

I feel like there's something else that you wanted to, to bring up, but I'm not sure what it is.

It it kind of ties into the You know, how If they're writing versus they're trailering it in, right, then the the the amount of range they need to get, you know, the distance to get to the trail, the equipment they bring, all of that.

Um, so that's why it's kind of like, yeah, how do they get there, I, I guess, you know, what do they? What do they normally bring if they're, you know, an existing IC writer, for example, what do they already bring? Mm, would be a good question.

In case like you said, OK, do they already bring cans of gas? If so, how much for the equivalent range? Yeah, yeah, like cause they're already.

They, they already, which is also kind of interesting, right, cause what are they already being with them helps me understand a little bit more about if they want to buy a second battery.

Not not fully, but it gets close like they already expect that they're going to be out long enough to refresh this thing.

Now, is the second battery the right cost for them versus filling a gas can? Well we know that they know the battery is gonna cost a lot more than filling a gas can, but what does it cost to refill that battery? How long, how many times do they do that? And like, you know, those that that's the balance that you are all playing with all the time, right, of cost more here, save more there, and then now also it's a bit about the experience.

So if they're already doing that, then that might actually You know, help with this risk about how it might fail, right? So that's a great thing to learn, uh, what do they already bring with them, um.

You You also you highlight something like how do they get to the trail is I'm gonna just I'm gonna tap it off of this one, How do they get to the child is, is kind of also like, um, how much range do They have when they get to the show.

Mhm.

Right, um, It's not quite right.

I know it's not right, it's like capacity or whatever, but like if they, if they're riding their bike there versus if they're towing it there.

That that matters, right? Um.

OK, we got a lot of good, what do we need to learn, OK? Um, we're gonna pick one of these and we're gonna start figuring out how could we learn that, right? And, and so we're gonna go through this thing of like if we had a day, if we had a week, if we had a month, what are the different things that we could go do to learn, right, about any of these items here that help us figure out how it might fail.

Um, so let's pick one of those to go a little bit further on.

Yeah, then we can, so we could follow the how far or what did they bring with them? OK, Matthew, I think I like how far a little bit more.

OK, so we expand upon that one.

Also, before we go any further, um, Erin, I also, I like this one.

I'm glad that wasn't the one you chose, uh, but I think it's also neat about the learning on this one.

if you were to take this experiment a little further, what they are you bring with them to the trail.

We talked about um not having a gearbox, right, and not having to like change things out, being able to configure the ride mode, if that was the experiment that you that you chose, by being able to configure ride mode, this matters maybe a little bit more, right? Like, what is all the tooling that they're bringing? What do they need to, how, how do they, what do they change on their bike when they get to the trail to create the right ride experience and all that kind of stuff, right? Cause that, that certainly plays in there.

So it it plays a bit into.

How long do they go for to exhaust the battery, um, but it's, it's more tangential versus like how do they change the right experience, right, that this one relates a lot more directly to that experiment or to that hypothesis.

OK, so what are the things we could do to learn? How far are people ride in a day on the chest.

I guess we could just like literally set up, get a list of riders, meet up a trail and just give them a bunch of batteries and see how far they go until they're done.

That's the simplest thing I could off top of my head.

OK, so, uh, track, uh, so I'm gonna see if I, if I, yeah, I'm hearing this one right, uh, so yeah, track, um, uh, rides and used capacity.

Mhm.

OK, good.

What else can you do? Yeah, I'd I'd just show up to a trail and just, you know, when I see riders come back, you know, I just walk up and ask them, hey, you know, how long, how far did you ride, and where do you ride along the trail? How far did you get out? It's kind of more of a simple data collection kind of idea.

OK, I just, I'm just gonna go interview people.

I'm just gonna go ask them, you know, talk to them, OK? Good.

What other kinds of experiments could you run? Let me just get one more before I I go any further here.

Mhm I want you to learn how far people ride.

We learn.

Mentally I'm thinking like, well, we already kind of already said we talked to people.

Um, Hm.

Mm.

Not quite sure.

Not as, not as creative on this.

Matthew got another one? Trying to think on like a one day time scale.

And this one might be better suited for like a one week thing, but if we had like, you know, the, the manpower to do it in one day, um, maybe run a couple tests up side by side at different sites.

Mm.

With different trail conditions.

What kind of tests? Well, I guess similar, just, you know, see how long it can take, how much capacity gets used or.

How long they uh like the rider like spends at a given trail, but the the differences between the two locations is like maybe one trails like.

A little bit longer in length, but you know, there's not as much elevation change, it's not like the, the black diamond trail, it's a more of a bunny slope, I guess, um, and then versus like, yeah, like one that's shorter, but maybe steeper elevation changes, which does take up more capacity in a battery.

Um, so I guess that would be it like across different trails, which might be better suited for a one week trial, but.

No, that that's really good.

You, you actually, you, you also honed in on something that I was seeing.

You can just watch.

Uh, people complete stress.

Right, like I see a guy go out.

I know that the trailer that he sent out on or this, you know, uh, this loop here is um uh 2.

6 miles.

How many times do they, how many, how many laps does he make? Before he comes in, right? Oh, she's out there, you know, for, for a half hour she made, you know, like 6 laps, and she paused and then she went back out for a little bit longer, right? 789, OK, came back.

Decide to go and have like hang out at the campfire instead and have some beers, right? Like done riding for the day.

Cool.

9 laps times 2.

6 miles, you know, there's how far they go.

So like I, I can ask, but I honestly just watch it happen.

Like that's another cool thing too.

Just like tracking capacity on your bikes is another thing you can, you can go observe directly, which is pretty cool.

So that's, that's another neat piece of, um, all these things are fairly measurable towards like real results.

Like you can ask somebody how far did you go out for the day.

They can look down at the odometer and tell you, or they can just get like, I don't know, I kind of maybe about 30 miles, right, and there's a difference between their perceived measures versus like actual things like real data you can get into, um, and we want to know a little bit of that too, like the quantifiable and the quantitative and qualitative metrics.

So there might even be a thing of like, did you.

We might even ask writers at some point, like, did you feel that you were going to run out of fuel or capacity for the day? Right, they had a whole other piece, right, um, that's more about, um, do they care about range, right, um, versus isn't long enough, right? Um, so here's a question, uh, track rides across different trails.

Can you do that in a day? Like if you want, I mean, it's, it's what, 1:45 to 2 now your time, like if, if you, if Shayas or She's boss were to go and say like, hey, all right, so, um, tomorrow at 120, I want the results from your experiment.

Do you think you could actually go and run that experiment? By tomorrow.

Yeah, that's, that was the tricky thing is it was, uh, I was saying I guess you could get it done in a day if you had I guess two separate, like, let's say, you know, Aaron and I each one of us went to a, a long flat trail and Aaron goes to the shorter hilly one, and we kind of run the experiment side by side in parallel.

Then we could do it a day, but I guess it's if we're looking at just like one team, one set of people, it would be more of like a multi-day thing probably.

OK, good.

So like it's maybe uh if you had a week, yes, you could do that, right? Like, like you said, the running the experiment takes a couple hours to a day, but actually setting up the experiment, getting the picking the trails, getting the right people, actually being able to get to them, etc.

to design and execute on that, it might take you more than a week to run that experiment in its entirety.

Um, what are any of the other ones, do they, do they move over a little bit more that they, you couldn't go from, from now, like if we hung up now and you wanted to start executing on experiment now, you could have results on that by noon tomorrow.

Yeah, no, or I would bump the, um, you know, the actual writer interviews, probably bump that over to a week because it would be.

Probably track, you know, get more people on the weekend.

Ah, OK, so you'd want to wait on that just because of the time of day kind of thing.

That's interesting, um.

I feel like this one's, could you do this in a day? Track rides it needs capacity.

Yeah, I mean, I think that one's, cause that's more or less just grabbing information off of the bike, um, from a from a day's use kind of thing.

I mean that would probably just tie into at what point to have you enough data points that it's a usable value, right? Yeah.

Ah, yes, so what we might then that one could expand further.

Right, um, and we could find out a little more of like, are we seeing a theme here that's worth getting more data around.

Right Go sorry, that logic extends, I would say then to watch just the generals watch people complete the trails.

Both in terms of what trails they're completing and the number of people that we're observing.

OK, but you, you could just, if you decided, like, well, here's a question, how busy is your day tomorrow? Between today and tomorrow.

You have a you have a lot of things packed.

Would you have Would you have like an hour or two to just go out to any local trail and just watch people do runs? Hm.

Yes theoretically, I possibly could if I knew where there's some trails around me.

I don't think, I'm not sure how popular dirt, but, well, I don't know about dirt biking, but maybe mountain biking up where I am in Seattle.

I don't know about dirt biking though.

We'll see.

I'd have to do research on that first.

So this is an interesting thing.

I actually think like asking res on a trail and watching them complete it are both really quick.

Like you could just Go somewhere, like, I mean, um, and actually there's maybe some shorter ones or maybe they fall a little bit more, you know, you need, you need 2 days, right, something like that.

Uh, track rides and use capacity.

So Matthew, you said you don't even know where if where the local dirt bike trails are.

So, and you want to get your bikes to these trails that you don't know that exists and be able to measure their usage on people that do, do they have them or you just gonna say like, hey, I got a bike, you want to ride this for the day? Right, like, do you think you can do that in a day? In my, in my case, probably not.

This one also feels like it's maybe a week to a little bit longer, right? Cause it's again, it's, it's a, it's a bit of that, where are we going, what's happening? Like are are we watching, are we talking to existing customers that have their bikes and saying like, hey, when are you going out? Like I just want to go watch this stuff like, you know, tomorrow, like that.

That takes time.

Like, are they even gonna go out and ride? Or are you going to, you're gonna gather up 10 bikes, you're gonna load them on a trailer, you're gonna take them out, you're gonna run this thing like, do you, do you have that available to you right now? Could you go run it? If so, great, maybe you can go do that a day.

If not, it pushes out more towards that.

Maybe it takes a week just to pull all those resources together and run that experiment.

Right, but when you go to run it, the actual running of it takes a couple hours.

Um, but the, the, the setup for it might take a little bit longer.

OK.

Um, There are What I also love about everything you came up with.

It's all very direct measures.

You could do some other stuff too, right, um, if you had a day to find out like what, what if you just Searched like um like R slash dirt bikes.

I don't know, right? Go on Reddit and and ask people like, and you know, do a look in there like how are people talking about their rides? And how far they might ride.

Right, so you could do that in a day.

You can get some anecdotal evidence.

Again, is it the best data? No, but could you execute on it in a day? Probably.

Um, do you have anybody in your office? That does this kind of writing.

Anyway that you're in your company.

Yeah, like I was gonna say it's like, yeah, I could directly ask the guy, hey, you're taking the bike out for the weekend, right? Let me know.

Yeah.

Right, talk to coworkers to give your rides.

You got one of them, that's great.

You got 3 or 4 of them, that's better.

You got 10, cool.

Um, but that's like you have immediate access to these people.

Um, Right, or maybe related, um, talk to salespeople.

Who work with Carolines.

Maybe they get have some understanding of what they do.

I don't know if that's as good, but it's something, right? It's, it's much more indirect data, but at least you're gonna find out something more about like, hey, do you do your chair owns ever talk about like being out for hours? So with those kinds of thoughts, anything else you think you can do like really quick, really cheap.

I say yeah, real quick, real cheap to get a ride myself.

Yeah, I mean that that's That's kind of cool too, like, take a ride.

That, that's a The problem is, are you a customer that you're trying to sell for? No, right, that's, yeah.

Right, so this motorcycle rider? Absolutely not.

But you know, we've got some interesting categories of things here, right? Like, um, you've kind of got, this is like your desk research, right? Search charter bikes, that kind of thing, um, this is more like, you know, like I said, leverage, leverage your co-workers, figure out what's going on there, right, start to see, and then when you start to get to like things like this, you, you're getting in on like these are direct measures, right, that that really help us know what's going on.

So.

Sometimes you're gonna get access to the right people and and you can do that, and that's really cool.

Sometimes to do those kinds of things that takes takes more time, right? You're actually gonna need like a week to get out there and do something like that.

What if you had a month? What if you had a whole month to design and execute on an experiment to learn about how far people ride in a day on the trails to see if they actually ride long enough to exhaust the battery.

It's one thing that came to my mind kind of goes on hand with.

If it kind of dips into a bunch of things I would say, but.

Like in terms of, like, you know, understanding, you know, how much they actually use.

I guess it'd be nice to know if we could make some sort of, with like our range estimates on like our street legal bikes, we typically advertise like your typical like street ride range, like if you're just kind of riding around town, if you're on the highway, if you're riding at like 55 miles an hour versus 70 miles an hour, we have all those like those three different metrics for range.

For something like trail riding and dirt bike riding like maybe.

Having something like that falls in line with a matrix to define the expected range depending on the the trail type, like we said, flat, hilly, steep, having a a matrix that better outlines to, you know, perspective owners.

Um, what they can expect depending on their preferred like trail riding experiences.

OK, um, I listed that up there as like create a trail ride estimation tool, right, cause like, or you're, you're talking a little bit on the site of like.

How fast are you going and that that puts a bit on the range.

And so now you're talking about building a building a little experimenting tool.

And maybe even measuring how much do people say that they do certain kinds of rides to give them various kinds of estimates, right? Um, yeah, it was, uh, you know, actually tracking, do people change their, you know, trail selection based on the ride or based on the range they experience like, as they become more familiar with the product, do they change their habits? Uh, change their trail, uh, I'm sorry, say that one more time.

How, how often they change their what their, their.

So their configuration, um, changed their trail selection.

OK, channel selection.

Right, if they know that they only have 40 miles of range, do they now then intentionally choose shorter trails, or do they, you know, do they not care and just continue riding the way they do? Mm, OK, and there's, well, just get through it and, you know, I'm only out for an hour today versus 5, something like that.

Yeah.

OK, um, You have a changing trail section was um you're actually talking about the physical trail, right? Yes, OK, um, what about how often they change? Like commode.

Hm.

I would say Another thing is like more of a question that to be answered is.

You know, falling in line with does the current battery design work.

Like we talked about uh, previously, like, well, do we need to just redesign a new the battery to be bigger and have better range, so I guess maybe the way to frame it is.

Like for the average rider or trail rider, is one battery enough or is one battery swap like.

I guess understanding what is the ideal number of battery swaps that would be needed for a given for the average rider.

I'm not sure how to word that per se though, but I guess um.

Yeah, go ahead.

I guess ideally that number with the with our current design, we would ideally want that to be, yeah, one battery would be sufficient or maybe like one swap, but nothing more than that, um, would be like the ideal case, I would imagine, because then you, then you'd have to buy a bunch of packs, which kind of goes into the cost thing that we talked about.

We're trying to think like what's like the shortest way to say that, I guess, yeah, I guess like what is the, is one pack enough for the average rider? I I guess what we'd want to learn.

Is one bad enough.

And that's really like the, the question, people don't ride long enough to exhaust the battery.

Right, so whatever your current battery is, I know you, you probably have multiple battery configurations, or do you not? Is it just one battery? For this, this particular dirt bike is one battery, but we do like our other motorcycle models have like different size batteries as well.

OK, um, and, and so I think like that's a, it's an interesting question that comes up for a lot of people, right? Like, When when you have a gas engine vehicle, um, you have fixed capacity as well.

How many gallons are in, you know, of capacity as the tank? Similar thing, how big is the battery? Like you, you don't change that day to day when you're riding the, you know, um, uh, a gas engine vehicle.

You can change that day to day if you had a swappable battery, which is actually kind of intriguing, right? And um you can choose like to top up your, your, you know, the battery all the way.

You can also choose to like, I just want 50% charge and it's fine just like I'm just gonna fill the tank halfway, right? Um, but when you're talking about batteries, you're also talking about like the equivalent for us is gas cans, right? Like am I bringing along.

You know, a an extra 1 gallon of gas, 5 gallons of gas, 15 gallons of gas, like how much do I need to really do the kinds of things that we want to do for the day and like, am I fueling myself or am I fueling others and, you know, that that maybe plays in for some people, not everybody, right now you're not your typical writer, but you actually can like You know, another interesting pieces, do they need a different kind of battery for different kinds of things, because you put in a bigger battery, let's say, right, like that's, let's say that it's just actually they're riding close to the limit.

Maybe if we just built a slightly bigger battery, that would be enough.

Right? Well, what are the downsides of that? Oh wait, more weight, yeah, more weight, changes the ride experience, changes the handling, changes its torque, well, not really, but it changes, you know, like just essentially how you're gonna get that, that kind of changed the experience, yeah, changes the experience.

Um, batteries aren't, they don't hold the same level of capacity over time.

Right, so you can make it a little bit bigger now, and that gives that meets actually the majority of the need for what you're finding, but Suddenly now it doesn't, and now people can't get the right experience they want anymore, right? So maybe that's another good reason for just a swap.

Um, maybe because battery weight matters if they're actually riding shorter distances.

Um, we can choose to be able to create cheaper, smaller batteries that are lighter weight that also again affect the ride experience, but perhaps in a really good way for the rider, right? So that's an intriguing piece here too, that we actually sell it with a bigger battery, but we sell smaller packs for quick swaps and shorter rides.

If you're only gonna be out for like the hour or two.

It's kind of like we, we can give them the opportunity to configure it the way they want.

Yeah.

You can't do that on a gas engine.

the same way.

Right? They're gonna run out of fuel and you have to fill up versus like I have this tuned in for this experience.

You know, a little bit differently, right? I put in a bigger pack so I don't have to change out the battery for this ride cause I'm taking.

I'm on a 100 mile, you know, dirt road trek with a bunch of friends to get up into these, you know, this canyon or something like that.

Cool, right? That's a different experience, um, versus like I'm going out to a trail that's like 2 miles long and I'm just gonna run it a couple of times just for fun.

Right, so you can really, you can hone in not just on software, but even on physical product a little bit more for them.

It's like if the, if the thing doesn't go at least 100 miles, let's say for the bike, and it probably does.

They can't even do that canyon ride, right? They can always put in less gas for a shorter ride, but they can't even get there.

They have to bring along, you know, more fuel or something like that where you might have a battery that actually meets it that.

You know, I can give you that other option.

Um, Yeah, there's just some interesting things here.

Here's a, here's another one throw out there for if you had a month, um.

And we're just, we're hypothesizing now cause like again, we're getting to a month, that's a lot of time and investment, um, but you could uh create uh sales uh for spare batteries.

Right, uh, what's the website look like for that? How do people buy them? How do they integrate them, what software needs to change in order to, if at all, to connect up the battery, like resets and such on.

I did swap and the, the OS has to know that, right? um.

So I can sell it and I can even do that cheaper too, again, maybe not a day, but I can create a sales page.

That doesn't actually sell anyone batteries.

I see what the, you know, the click through rate and the interest, how many people are following it.

Yeah, like that.

So I'm gonna, I'm gonna put that under, under one week maybe here of um.

Uh, create a sign up page.

Or um extra batteries.

Right.

I can't remember I'm trying to remember what that prototype was called.

All out of my head right now.

And say kind of more strongly ties into the second point that we're, you know, the people don't want to buy a second batter idea.

Um.

Right, it's the, yeah, and the way they're they are related, right this.

Yeah, this one's more indirect, right? So I could, it's interesting.

I could find out, I could create a sign up page for extra batteries, and by monitoring the click through on that, like how many people try to buy an extra battery, even if we don't already sell them.

That's gonna give me a lot more indication about will they even buy a second battery, but it also gives me incidental information about, are they concerned in the first place.

Yeah, right? Like it's, it's a, it's that's also why I think it was more important that you went with the people don't ride long enough to exhaust the battery.

Like if they're never riding long enough for any of their adventures, and they can always come back and plug it in.

They're probably not even gonna care about buying a second battery, you know, they won't even click that button.

Um, so this one's much more impactful to the whole thing, whereas like, it's a, if, if we get people clicking through, like I said, we, if they're not willing to buy a second battery, we don't know yet if it's because it's cost, because they don't want to haul it around, um, or because they actually have enough range as it is, right? So this one is much more impactful for understanding.

Is there a point in making that sale in the first place.

But if they do buy it, we probably have the idea that they want to go farther, and they can go now, or they want to be able to do that quicker.

Right, they don't want to wait an hour or two for a charge, and especially if you're on the trail.

OK.

So, we're starting to see some interesting experiments, right? Some much more longer term things you can dive into to learn about this, um, heck, you could monitor.

The GPS locations of riders.

There is, you know, at.

If you had a month, you could probably do that, maybe even a week, I don't know, right? of you really want to get towards software solutions, how far do people rhyme? Well, they already got our app on, or they, I can give them an app uh that just tracks their ride lengths, or I can go maybe ask.

Actually, it's kind of interesting.

You might have this some of this data somewhere, right? Like if I think about, I don't know if you, you know, you do any of that kind of tracking right now, but if you had that kind of information, some of these things are are answerable enough of like somebody somewhere has actually already done this research, we can go talk to them.

And that really short circuits it and it helps us figure out, OK, cool.

Now I have actually some validated learning on this concept because somebody already did that.

Or somebody knows how to go do that really quickly.

Let me go talk and work with them, and then come back to what's another experiment that I can, that I need to go run.

Now that I have this data, what adds the story? What gives me more of that information, um, that helps me, you know, prove out if this thing's going to fail or not.

So I can decide to go run that experiment, create this feature, and How are you feeling there? Questions? Comments? So they just kind of different ideas it's like, you know, it's like now we can also touch on like what are their charging habits.

Yeah, as you said, right, you know, like with a gas can, you know, they choose how much they want to fill up with the charging, you know, it's kind of, yeah, they can choose how long, you know, what charge percentage they wanna hit or if they just decide, yeah, you know, 2 hours with the charging is enough, I'm gonna go back and use whatever I got in those 2 hours.

Yeah, like I, I don't have a lot of time to go out and ride, but this is just, this is good enough to get me out and have some fun for a while.

And then I come back and like grill for a party for the day or like who knows what it is, right? You, um, you get to find out some more of those things.

So actually like that's an even interesting thing is like how, I don't know if it's it's a day or a week, so I'm just gonna, I'm gonna put it somewhere in the middle.

Um, how many rides? All right.

Uh, to people.

Take before they charge.

Right, that's an interesting question.

Uh, to ask too if it's like 12 rides.

You probably got enough capacity.

Right.

OK.

So, um, I, just a quick question.

Do you know, is Shas coming back or we have we lost him for the rest of the day? Uh, he, well, actually, technically, Matthew and I also was supposed to be in that meeting, I think, but OK, I would be safe to assume we probably lost him for the rest.

OK, so we're wrapping up today and we're gonna start talking about the um the homework for the next week, all right? Um, and so I just wanted to know if, you know, if I was expecting to see him come along with this or, um, or, you know, or not.

But here's the catch up on the homework.

OK, so you came up with a bunch of different ideas, right? Some of these experiments and, and maybe there's another one that you can get into, but like, I said you've crafted some different things, especially the stuff for one day is really intriguing.

One week might be possible.

We're gonna meet up in a week, right? We're gonna have our next class again in a week.

And so, uh, your homework for the class.

Um, is, is really hone in on that experiment, right, and do the last little bit of planning for it.

We, we kind of already, I said, got some ideas, so maybe what's the least amount you can do to learn? What are you gonna find out in a day or two or so, or just an hour even.

I want you to actually go run an experiment.

Pick one of those experiments, go run it.

And then use that to figure out what would be your next steps towards your hypothesis, OK? Um, let me know as well what happened with that, right, as you're doing, um, your experiments.

So, um, I'm gonna also, I'm gonna give you a little tip about the the talking to people one before we go any further, but like this is, I, I actually want you to go and and ideally.

Talk to or observe the behaviors of real people.

Mhm.

OK.

So this is, this is, uh, I loved it when I, when I did this, um, but that, that's a key piece of homework here for it and you know, we have a few videos for the next week, so catch up on this, those last little bits.

Um, so if you, if you're like actually talking to people like co-workers who ride, um, people on how long they rode for that day, that kind of thing, um, we don't get into it too much here in this class, uh, but you, you know, it's good to consider as you're interviewing people.

Um, try to suppress your emotions.

Right, you feel like, oh, how far you ride for the day, you know, uh, 20 miles.

Oh, that's cool.

You rode 20 miles.

Is that typically how far you go? Right, so like, yeah, yeah, yeah, 20 miles, that seems like a good ride, right, cause they know they saw you get excited.

And I want to go a little bit further, right? It's, it's good and said to say, um, you know, like, you know, oh, how far did you run for the day? 20 miles.

I see you rode 20 miles.

Just put that see it back out.

Good.

Um, how, how often do you ride like that? Well, not that much.

OK, so today was a different amount of time.

Yeah, yeah, right, and the, the more you leave that open, the more they'll tell you.

Right as you're interviewing them, um, another great tip, um, I don't know if it applies to this, it's um.

You, you say, tell me about a time.

Right, like, tell me about a time when.

So like, for example, tell me about a time when you wanted to do a bunch of cho writing, and you ran out.

Of gas, or like, or you you you couldn't go for the whole day.

What happened? What did you do? What you, what you do next, right? What, how, how did that make you feel? Right, and just kind of drive into questions like that, um, what would, what would make that better, right? Um, and so you, as you're trying to find out this, this bit, you can ask people about sort of like, uh, you know, tell me about a time that you wrote less.

And you thought you would.

Right, and and even dive into that of how often does that happen? Um, and that will help give you some more information.

So if you're getting into interviews with people, try to keep them open ended so that they can fill it in, rather than like, do you ride more than 30 miles in a day? Yes, cool, great, I got my data, right, like, well how often and whatever else, like we're not surveying them there so much as we are trying to learn about their experiences, their themes, and what really matters.

Uh, so that we can figure out how that helps answer our question, right, of course, how long did you ride today is like that has a definitive answer, um, but then we can maybe expand upon that, but try to stay neutral as you're talking to people, and that will get them talking a little bit more.

Yeah, like in the case of that question right now, and then trying to tease out whether or not that's, they hit their target or not if they're satisfied with how far they went or something like that.

Yeah, exactly.

Was that your tar, you know, what was your target for the day? Like how did that make you feel? and stuff like that, really good, really good points.

OK, so, so that's gonna be your homework here is go run your experiment, go talk to real people.

Who could help you learn.

About your risk, right? And uh run your experiment, figure out what's, what can you do to learn that, and how does, what does that tell you about your risk and your hypothesis, OK? Um, try to give me record like a short video, write up a, you know, a little statement about what you discovered.

And How it felt for you.

And as you're going through, that's what I would love to to learn um in in clarity flow, and then we'll discuss the results of your experiment further uh in next week's class.

OK.

Right, sounds good.

Yeah, anything else that you are curious about for me before we wrap up for the day? No, I think.

OK.

Nothing for me? All right, cool.

Well then, let me pause the recording or stop this here